Tuesday, February 14, 2012

A Message From Andrew McKenzie

Posting some Andrew McKenzie records, I knew there was a risk of seeing him ask to remove the posts as he often did on other blogs sharing The Hafler Trio material - though I made the choice, as I always try to do, to post only long time out-of-print releases (he has also expressed his views here). His message has arrived but this time this is not only a request to remove the links but also a kind of proposal. Feel free to answer him in comments. Here is the message :

I am the copyright owner in the recorded work referenced here: I have never given, nor have I ever been asked to give, permission to include this material in any way in this form.

I would ask, respectfully and politely, that you remove this as soon as possible.

I know that some people find this absurd, even though I have indicated many times my reasons for this publicly. I also have been insulted publicly simply for making my wishes known. I have also seen people try to justify their actions by stating that they are, by posting such material in a manner against my express wishes, 'helping' me, and 'doing me a favour'.

some people do listen, and remove the material - most times, however, it is clear that they do so out of fear of legal action, and not their own conscience.

so. I have a proposal for an alternative situation, one which will help everybody concerned. if enough people gather together who wish to post this material and *really* help me, I will reciprocate. I and the organisation to which I belong are looking for an agent. details of this can be found at http://www.simplysuperior.org. if we are sucessfully provided with one, we will not only pay the person leading us to that situation, but actually give you a release to post as far and wide as you please, with no restrictions. moreover, this will be ONLY available through your channels.

this is a sincere offer, and made in the spirit of genuine desire for co-operation. I will be pleased to answer any questions directed to me away from this channel.

./andrew m. mckenzie
p.p. The Hafler Trio


Anonymous said...

Greetings NDLB: Quite an interesting proposal. Fact is years ago I purchased both Mother Tongue and Protection . Of course they have been long sold and undoubtedly appear in the collections of some unknown entities. Shall we ask these unknown entities if they are willing to pay Andrew NOW for the pleasure of "ownership"? How many times do we pay Andrew? Maybe he should ask numerous second hand retailers including Ebay types resellers for a cut of HIS "resold" copyrighted material? I think not. Andrew simply put these items up on bandcamp, that is if indeed you really are the owner and not Jon W.of Touch. Kind regards.

the mullah said...

last time I looked, I was not, nor have ever been Jon Wozencroft, nor have I ever desired to be.

as you may note on reading the post a second time, I am not asking for money for old work, but suggesting there is a way to have intelligent use of resources.

my proposal is genuine, and is a real opportunity to make a good situation out of a less than desirable one. I am not threatening, I am asking. nicely.

you are of course free to disregard this attempt as the efforts of a pathetic old windbag to try to exert what little authority he has on a public that doesn't actually care.

or you may not.

./andrew mckenzie

Phillip Klingler said...


Anonymous said...

I have a theory that people like LaMonte Young and possibly the Hafler Trio engage in the activity of deliberately keeping their recording so far out of the hands of listeners so as to create the aura of mystery driving folks to a "must have ay any cost" mentality. Meanwhile they sit on a pile of their recordings and maintain multiple ebay, GEMM, Musicstack, and Discogs sales accounts :-)

Trian Troy said...

McKenzie did great music but he's full of shit. If he doesn't like people sharing his deleted CDs/LPs then he should reissue it and SELL it himself. A cd costs 400£ for 500 copies. Retail price 10£. 40 people will surely be interested in this "genius" work. I rest my case.

I'm so fed up with this elitist crap by people who think they invented the wheel. And yes, I wouldn't be suprised if these geniusses sell their own rare releases on ebay and the likes for big money.

ps. what a bullshit "agent" proposal. get a life !

Nassr Eddin said...

still a genuine proposal, "bullshit" or not, and honestly, genuinely meant.

I myself do not even have many of my own works, lost/stolen/given away over the years. I do not have any of these to sell on eBay or anywhere else.

manufacturing a CD with the h3o packaging is a GREAT deal more expensive than the numbers quoted here, which is why so few people have been able to do it, and why almost nobody has made any money out of them over the years, believe it, or believe it not.

and indeed, that is not what this proposal is about at all.

it was an attempt to do something interesting and valid, but I have received, alas, only rather negative and suspicious comments such as we see here on this page.

once I again, I meant the offer sincerely.

thanks for your interest, anyway.

./andrew mckenzie

Trian Troy said...

again bullshit andrew, half of your releases came in standard packaging. this elitist stuff that costs 3x standard price is ... well, elitist stuff that doesn't work anylonger anno 2013 where people wanna pay 10£ for a cd. 1000 digipaks costs 700£ (or less). 1000 jewelcases cost 400£ (or less). just google the net and find all kinds of great deals. as for "missing the recordings" i'm sure there's 100's of people (supporters who bought your music when it was available AND affordable) will gladly deliver it to u. my point is, your arguments are full of shit and this agent-thing, genuine or not, is full of shit too.

so fed-up with full of shit

Nassr Eddin said...

thank you for your comment, impolite as it was.

if I do not conform to the wishes of other people, I am full of excrement. message received.

I now remember the main reason why I stopped making records in the first place.

I invite you to have the last word (I shall no longer reply to anything here), and thank you again.

this offer is now withdrawn.

I wish you the best in your endeavours,

./andrew mckenzie

Trian Troy said...

your "I do not conform to the wishes of other people" is full of shit too.

i'm not looking for your music, hardcopy, as i have whatever release i like. however, there's plenty of people who don't have it and who appreciate people running a blog like this.

facts (here's some agent-advice, free of charge):

1. if you wanna SELL music to OTHER people u will have to "conform". conforming as in "offering a product other people (customers) are willing to buy for a fair price". people are not interested in some over-priced arty-farty cd.

2. if u wanna be a bitter, non-conforming wanker on the internet taking uploads offline, well, congrats, u've succeeded.

Anonymous said...

It's shameful how people speak to artists they don't even know. Lives they have no insight into. These facile crude, probably very young, people.

And all just because an artist does not bend to everyone's wishes. Pathetic behaviour.

I have bought LPs and CDs, both forms I cherish.

floyd kelley said...

I find that Mr. McKenzie is being quite reasonable and very polite with his request. Over the last few years, I've seen numerous independent artists in the same vein as The Hafler Trio (e.g. Nurse With Wound, Current 93, Lustmord) make their entire discography available for purchase via Bandcamp. In this day and age, collectibility seems to be more important than the music itself but some of us would love to be able to a.) possess this music once again b.) support the artist who made it.

What do you say Andrew? Can you (at least) think about it?

Anonymous said...

Blah blah blah, yadda yadda yadda. He's a fucking pretentious tosser at the end of the day.

Eric Tardiff said...

Man, all we wont is listen to this music be it on cd, k7 or vinyl or on a blog like this. I don't give a damn about possessing THE physical album. What interest me is the music, and I'm sure everyone who come along this site have the same desire. I'm an artist myself and never made big money out of what I'm producing, and never get to complaint about everyone who consume it from the net. It's part of our time, and music like any other art form are passed over freely to everyone on the net. One as to live with it.